What to do...

[Poppy 87]

Not sure what year that your truck is, but HEI distributor came out in '75. Also if the shop said that they "test" the module, it is not a breaker points ignition, as they are not fitted with an ignition module

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[Turbo4whl]

FOCUS DAMNIT. FOCUS!!!

Battery cables first. If they're questionable, replace them. Then go to the next thing.

Roger, you are so correct. Even if the cables look perfect, test them. Very easy, voltage drop test.

@thecantaloupeman if you do not know how to do a voltage drop test, please ask.

 

[MisterB]

Roger, you are so correct. Even if the cables look perfect, test them. Very easy, voltage drop test.

@thecantaloupeman if you do not know how to do a voltage drop test, please ask.

But what if there is a problem with the cables due to age from rubbing, bad connector, etc that may or may not always exhibit a symptom? Maybe it only happens when hitting a big enough bump, washboard road, extreme hot or cold? Would it not be best to just replace the cables, where they are an inexpensive wear item that probably is overdue after 40 years?

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[DoubleDingo]

Bad grounds and vacuum leaks can drive a person to drinking. They can be a pain in the arse. Fix them and all is well. Your vehicle will perform much better.

 

[Turbo4whl]

But what if there is a problem with the cables due to age from rubbing, bad connector, etc that may or may not always exhibit a symptom? Maybe it only happens when hitting a big enough bump, washboard road, extreme hot or cold? Would it not be best to just replace the cables, where they are an inexpensive wear item that probably is overdue after 40 years?

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I agree 30 or 40 year old cables should be on the list of items to replace. But if you are trying to locate a problem throwing parts at it that may still be okay will not fix the no start. The voltage drop test will tell you if you have a problem with the cable that you can not see.

 

[SirRobyn0]

I'm joining the party late so sorry about the long post. I think most all of you are on the right track. If I was giving this guy advise at the shop and couldn't get it to act up I'd say look at a fuel issue, pump and / or clogged filter also possibly a clogged sock in the tank and / or rust in tank. But could be a coil too.

You probably know how to use YouTube. I learned by asking questions and just taking things apart. There was no YouTube then.

I'll tell you as a pro, in the old days there we had a wall of books. Then we got a case of computer disks, then online manuals which we still use today, but we use youtube, and forum searches the most. We call it YouTube academy lol. Both for newer and older cars. There is information out there on the internet no factory manual has.

All these trucks should have at least one auxiliary fuel filter installed before the carb. These fuel systems if you have not upgraded are 40 years old and those carb filters are tiny!! The throw away ones are fast and easy to replace, and cheap and you can see into them to check for crap.

I disagree with multiple filters. I was just inside my 37 year old fuel tank and it is clean as a whistle. I have one filter only, if your tank is so bad you need more filters just replace the tank, there only a little over $100 each. Each filter creates a restriction, even when clean and as they collect junk, they just get worse. I once had a mid-70's dodge van in the shop, it was starving for fuel on long grades and he had vapor lock issues in anything over 75F weather. Turned out someone had installed 3 fuel filters on it. One at the tank, one mid-way (which was the factory spot), and one before the carb. His tank was ok, so we eliminated 2 of those filters and it stopped acting up on him.

Just an update. I picked it up and to my surprise they cut my cost in half because they didn’t find the problem. I also cleared up that the module in fact was 58$ for parts and 132$ for labor. They must have told me the combined cost if they charged me 120$ for the inspection and 194$ for the module. Still a bit steep but definitely reasonable.

They certainly seem to be trustworthy and know what they are doing. They did spark testing, ran a gas analyzer, fixed my carb adjustment that was apparently way off, tested the fuel pump vacuum.

Labor rates can vary dramatically depending on where your at. In my area most independent shops are $110 - $150. A mid grade ICM, is $25 - $30 my cost, so selling that to a customer at $58 is quite reasonable. 1 hour for diagnostic is pretty standard. $132 to install the ICM, so that looks to be a little more than one hour of labor, but perhaps they are setting the timing with that. Perhaps they would be in and out in 1/2 an hour and give you a break on that too. Everything else adds up and they cut you diag charge since they couldn't get it to act up. All of that points to them being a legitimate place. And everything they did was for $58. I'm not saying you should take it back to them, doing work yourself can be very rewarding, but I wouldn't be afraid to use that shop based on what you have said.

Bad grounds and vacuum leaks can drive a person to drinking.

I couldn't agree more. Vacuum leaks are at least tangible and in a shop environment usually not to hard to find with a smoke tester. Plus there is always the replace all vacuum line method. Grounds, those are a real nightmare. I once had a 1994 Buick Century at the shop. It would stall on the customer when coming to a stop, then restart, would happen maybe once a month. It progressively got worse over the course of a year or more, sometimes it would take several minutes before it would restart. At the shop everything would test out ok, and we could never get it to happen for us. It got to the point where if it happened in town, I'd ask her to call us, I'd drop everything and hope to get to her before it would restart. Eventually I was able to make it, before it restarted. No fuel pressure (in tank electric), once it restarted we drove it to the shop. Replaced the fuel pump thinking it was a intermittent issue with the pump, only to have it happen again. On that failure I found a loose ground connection inside the trunk.

 

[thecantaloupeman]

I'm joining the party late so sorry about the long post. I think most all of you are on the right track. If I was giving this guy advise at the shop and couldn't get it to act up I'd say look at a fuel issue, pump and / or clogged filter also possibly a clogged sock in the tank and / or rust in tank. But could be a coil too.



I'll tell you as a pro, in the old days there we had a wall of books. Then we got a case of computer disks, then online manuals which we still use today, but we use youtube, and forum searches the most. We call it YouTube academy lol. Both for newer and older cars. There is information out there on the internet no factory manual has.



I disagree with multiple filters. I was just inside my 37 year old fuel tank and it is clean as a whistle. I have one filter only, if your tank is so bad you need more filters just replace the tank, there only a little over $100 each. Each filter creates a restriction, even when clean and as they collect junk, they just get worse. I once had a mid-70's dodge van in the shop, it was starving for fuel on long grades and he had vapor lock issues in anything over 75F weather. Turned out someone had installed 3 fuel filters on it. One at the tank, one mid-way (which was the factory spot), and one before the carb. His tank was ok, so we eliminated 2 of those filters and it stopped acting up on him.



Labor rates can vary dramatically depending on where your at. In my area most independent shops are $110 - $150. A mid grade ICM, is $25 - $30 my cost, so selling that to a customer at $58 is quite reasonable. 1 hour for diagnostic is pretty standard. $132 to install the ICM, so that looks to be a little more than one hour of labor, but perhaps they are setting the timing with that. Perhaps they would be in and out in 1/2 an hour and give you a break on that too. Everything else adds up and they cut you diag charge since they couldn't get it to act up. All of that points to them being a legitimate place. And everything they did was for $58. I'm not saying you should take it back to them, doing work yourself can be very rewarding, but I wouldn't be afraid to use that shop based on what you have said.



I couldn't agree more. Vacuum leaks are at least tangible and in a shop environment usually not to hard to find with a smoke tester. Plus there is always the replace all vacuum line method. Grounds, those are a real nightmare. I once had a 1994 Buick Century at the shop. It would stall on the customer when coming to a stop, then restart, would happen maybe once a month. It progressively got worse over the course of a year or more, sometimes it would take several minutes before it would restart. At the shop everything would test out ok, and we could never get it to happen for us. It got to the point where if it happened in town, I'd ask her to call us, I'd drop everything and hope to get to her before it would restart. Eventually I was able to make it, before it restarted. No fuel pressure (in tank electric), once it restarted we drove it to the shop. Replaced the fuel pump thinking it was a intermittent issue with the pump, only to have it happen again. On that failure I found a loose ground connection inside the trunk.

Now I’m gonna wondering if this is a ground issue. This could be related to multiple things. This could maybe be related to why my gas gauge worked intermittently a while ago, and also maybe why the temp gauge doesn’t work. I’ve always had weird electrical issues like that. How can I check all my grounds to make sure they are good?


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[SirRobyn0]

Now I’m gonna wondering if this is a ground issue. This could be related to multiple things. This could maybe be related to why my gas gauge worked intermittently a while ago, and also maybe why the temp gauge doesn’t work. I’ve always had weird electrical issues like that. How can I check all my grounds to make sure they are good?


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Because this is a carbed vehicle, I doubt that it's a ground issue, and would not be the first thing I'd check. If there were a ground issue relating to the running issues it would only effect spark, as the fuel system is all mechanical in your rig. What I said earlier was more an example of a nightmare ground issue, not directed at you or your truck so much I apologize if I was unclear.

 

[MisterB]

Now I’m gonna wondering if this is a ground issue. This could be related to multiple things. This could maybe be related to why my gas gauge worked intermittently a while ago, and also maybe why the temp gauge doesn’t work. I’ve always had weird electrical issues like that. How can I check all my grounds to make sure they are good?


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There's not much to them. Remove them, clean them, clean the bolts/screws, and clean the area behind each bolt screw on the frame or wherever they are connected. You may need to use steel wool. If any are cut or frayed badly, replace them

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[HotRodPC]

Nice of you to take the time to explain the difference, instead of being a dick by trying to shame him with the whole line "you don't know what HEI looks like!?!?"

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That **** don't fly here @MisterB. This isn't pirate4x4 or Facebook. There's different levels of mechanical ability and experience in all of us.

 

[thecantaloupeman]

That **** don't fly here @MisterB. This isn't pirate4x4 or Facebook. There's different levels of mechanical ability and experience in all of us.

Thank you! This is exactly how I feel. I’m glad someone understands. And now that I’m learning all of this stuff I’m already starting to help out others. It’s a cycle. When people on this forum help me, I’ll eventually be able to help someone else who has a similar issue, and then maybe that leads them to help someone else out as well.


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[thecantaloupeman]

I'm joining the party late so sorry about the long post. I think most all of you are on the right track. If I was giving this guy advise at the shop and couldn't get it to act up I'd say look at a fuel issue, pump and / or clogged filter also possibly a clogged sock in the tank and / or rust in tank. But could be a coil too.



I'll tell you as a pro, in the old days there we had a wall of books. Then we got a case of computer disks, then online manuals which we still use today, but we use youtube, and forum searches the most. We call it YouTube academy lol. Both for newer and older cars. There is information out there on the internet no factory manual has.



I disagree with multiple filters. I was just inside my 37 year old fuel tank and it is clean as a whistle. I have one filter only, if your tank is so bad you need more filters just replace the tank, there only a little over $100 each. Each filter creates a restriction, even when clean and as they collect junk, they just get worse. I once had a mid-70's dodge van in the shop, it was starving for fuel on long grades and he had vapor lock issues in anything over 75F weather. Turned out someone had installed 3 fuel filters on it. One at the tank, one mid-way (which was the factory spot), and one before the carb. His tank was ok, so we eliminated 2 of those filters and it stopped acting up on him.



Labor rates can vary dramatically depending on where your at. In my area most independent shops are $110 - $150. A mid grade ICM, is $25 - $30 my cost, so selling that to a customer at $58 is quite reasonable. 1 hour for diagnostic is pretty standard. $132 to install the ICM, so that looks to be a little more than one hour of labor, but perhaps they are setting the timing with that. Perhaps they would be in and out in 1/2 an hour and give you a break on that too. Everything else adds up and they cut you diag charge since they couldn't get it to act up. All of that points to them being a legitimate place. And everything they did was for $58. I'm not saying you should take it back to them, doing work yourself can be very rewarding, but I wouldn't be afraid to use that shop based on what you have said.



I couldn't agree more. Vacuum leaks are at least tangible and in a shop environment usually not to hard to find with a smoke tester. Plus there is always the replace all vacuum line method. Grounds, those are a real nightmare. I once had a 1994 Buick Century at the shop. It would stall on the customer when coming to a stop, then restart, would happen maybe once a month. It progressively got worse over the course of a year or more, sometimes it would take several minutes before it would restart. At the shop everything would test out ok, and we could never get it to happen for us. It got to the point where if it happened in town, I'd ask her to call us, I'd drop everything and hope to get to her before it would restart. Eventually I was able to make it, before it restarted. No fuel pressure (in tank electric), once it restarted we drove it to the shop. Replaced the fuel pump thinking it was a intermittent issue with the pump, only to have it happen again. On that failure I found a loose ground connection inside the trunk.

Thanks for the write up! Means a lot that you took the time to do all that. I went to the auto parts store today and got myself and MSD Cap and rotor set, some accel spark plug wires, ACDELCO plugs, and an ignition module. I have a few questions though.

The spark plug wire set was supposed to be the right one for a gm v8, but some of the spark plug wire lengths didn’t match up very well, I’ve got maybe two wires that are too long. Not a huge deal but I want to make sure this is the right set. It also had a left over wire that has two black ends rather than a black and red. I installed the plugs and new wires and it ran just fine, but I want to make sure I’m not missing something.

I also am wondering about my plugs because they are a different number than what I had. The actual white part was either longer or shorter I can’t remember but the threads looked the same. I will attach a pic of the old plugs and the new. The old ones were autolites and said #26. The new ones are ACDelco #4R44T. I think the computer said they had .035 gap.




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[Rusty Nail]

eww @ autolites in a chebby. grooossss!
them are ford plugs.
good riddance!

right plug wires, run the long ones up front and make it look nice with the length.

that odd wire out is for an external ignition coil.
useless to your application but hang on to it anyways.


everything sounds great but wtf no pix?

please try again.
do not pass go
sure as hell do not collect $200 with no pix.

 

[80BrownK10]

eww @ autolites in a chebby. grooossss!
them are ford plugs.
good riddance!

right plug wires, run the long ones up front and make it look nice with the length.

that odd wire out is for an external ignition coil.
useless to your application but hang on to it anyways.


everything sounds great but wtf no pix?

please try again.
do not pass go
sure as hell do not collect $200 with no pix.

What he said. 44 and 45 are the common Delco plugs. Yep autolites are great cheap plugs. They work but there Ford plugs from back in the day. Before the Motorcraft plugs.

 

[thecantaloupeman]

eww @ autolites in a chebby. grooossss!
them are ford plugs.
good riddance!

right plug wires, run the long ones up front and make it look nice with the length.

that odd wire out is for an external ignition coil.
useless to your application but hang on to it anyways.


everything sounds great but wtf no pix?

please try again.
do not pass go
sure as hell do not collect $200 with no pix.

Sorry I was on my phone and was gonna edit it on my computer to add the photos. I can't upload more than one photo without tapatalk VIP on my phone unless i use internet browser.

I went with the accel wires because I wanted a nice performance set without spending 100$ on msds. I did a bit of research and it seemed that accel was pretty well regarded as an alternative to MSD. Main reason though was because they were cheap. Cheaper than ACDelco in fact and much cooler looking! I got the MSD cap and rotor so I could have a red distributor and also because it was a good deal and MSD makes good quality stuff. Went with ACDelco plugs just to be safe and not break the bank. Especially since I wasn't 100% sure they were the right ones. The accel Ignition module was 50$ so I bought that too instead of getting the ACdelco one like I planned and also because it was what they had in stock. I think I did pretty well. Got the plugs and wires in today. Plan on doing the rest later and also buying new battery cables.

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