Adjusting rear drums - pulling trailers

[AuroraGirl]

I was driving and pulling my 3/4 ton trailer with a 1/2 ton truck. I could really tell without trailer brakes how the trailer really was pushing the truck around more so than the other way. However, it felt like the rear doesnt... do its share and thus wants to push the back end out(the truck had at least 600 pounds of sand in bed, not thinking it was from no weight on rear wheels). Ive noticed it while generally driving, it seems like the truck wants to kick out left in the rear as if its not working as hard. I will be regularily pulling this trailer with a safe load(and ocassionally a trailer with a car on), is there a more aggressive setting I should set the rear brakes to or how do you guys approach that?

 

[Blue Ox]

If you're talking about the rear brakes on the truck, I usually set them so they have a little less than 1/8" of play when you pry the adjuster back and forth through the slot in the backing plate. That's not the official procedure, but I find it does the job and leaves a fairly high pedal without dragging.

 

[AuroraGirl]

If you're talking about the rear brakes on the truck, I usually set them so they have a little less than 1/8" of play when you pry the adjuster back and forth through the slot in the backing plate. That's not the official procedure, but I find it does the job and leaves a fairly high pedal without dragging.

Is that your experience while pulling a trailer loaded and unloaded? Im most worried about a steep grade that comes to a quick stop, even slowing down well in advance, gravity really wants to push that trailer down the hill. It really feels like the rear doesnt do its part there because of that pushing, ontop already being out of adjustment.

 

[85 CA SIERRA 1500]

Is that your experience while pulling a trailer loaded and unloaded? Im most worried about a steep grade that comes to a quick stop, even slowing down well in advance, gravity really wants to push that trailer down the hill. It really feels like the rear doesnt do its part there because of that pushing, ontop already being out of adjustment.

Hi Aurora,,,,,The big thing that you are missing here is brakes on your trailer,,,,,trust me I have done tons of towing( u catch that pun?), the trailer should never be pushing the tow rig, the rear brakes on your truck are not the problem. This is simple physics, the hitch is a pivot point, so when the trailer pushes against your truck as opposed to being pulled by it, it rarely will be pushing in a straight line but either a little to the left or a little to the right, this is where it makes the back of the truck want to kick out.
Do yourself a favor and get brakes on your trailer and a good brake controller in the cab, something like a Prodigy P3,,,,,,stay away from the cheapo timed delay ones.
All the best,
Tracey>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

 

[da_raabi]

Something else to note or look at. Some of these trucks had a "load leveling valve" or something that would adjust rear brake force based on the weight on the back of the truck. It's a weird lever-like thing up under the bed above the pumpkin. You should see the rear brake lines going to it.

These things are known to go bad, and really were not very useful to begin with. I pulled the one off of my dooley when I re-did my rear drums and simply connected the lines directly together. I've had zero rear-brake issues since then.

Might want to take a look at it. I don't know if your truck came with one stock but its worth taking a peek.

 

[Blue Ox]

What 85 said.

There isn't much improvement to be had beyond having the truck's brakes adjusted and operating correctly. After that it's time for some trailer brakes.

 

[GXPWeasel]

X3 on trailer brakes.
I don't like pulling very heavy at all without trailer brakes. They can make a world of difference.

 

[SirRobyn0]

In the state I live at least trailers weighing more than 2,000 require trailer brakes. With that said you stated you were towing your 3/4 ton trailer. Is that as in the trailer loaded weighs 3/4 of ton as in 1,500 LBS total? that amount behind you should not be pushing your truck around. You should be able to feel it, but it shouldn't be huge. If the trailer empty weighs maybe 1,000LBS plus you had 1,500 LBS of weight, well then you'd feel that more. I'll give an example, not that I would ever suggest that doing this is a good idea or even safe, but one time I had to tow my Grand Cherokee to the shop. The GC has a tow bar, but I don't have a brake setup for it. It's 15 miles of hilly county roads. I had trouble getting my truck going on the incline in my gravel driveway because it's a 2wd and the gravel is a bit loose, but after that it felt basically ok. Stopping distances were longer than I really felt comfortable with, but I never felt like I was being shoved along either. My truck is a C-20 so it does have larger rear shoes than your 1/2 ton.

Bottom line I'd say this. Make sure the rear brakes are working on the truck. start by lifting the rear wheels off the ground, have someone press the brakes and see if you can turn the rear wheels, if you can it's probably a bad proportioning valve. you'd be surprised how much I've seen this on older trucks in the shop when someone complains that the brakes just don't seem to be stopping as well as they should. Then adjust the brakes, if your still uncomfortable, either tow less weight, or get brakes on the trailer. Be safe.

 

[AuroraGirl]

X3 on trailer brakes.
I don't like pulling very heavy at all without trailer brakes. They can make a world of difference.

In the state I live at least trailers weighing more than 2,000 require trailer brakes. With that said you stated you were towing your 3/4 ton trailer. Is that as in the trailer loaded weighs 3/4 of ton as in 1,500 LBS total? that amount behind you should not be pushing your truck around. You should be able to feel it, but it shouldn't be huge. If the trailer empty weighs maybe 1,000LBS plus you had 1,500 LBS of weight, well then you'd feel that more. I'll give an example, not that I would ever suggest that doing this is a good idea or even safe, but one time I had to tow my Grand Cherokee to the shop. The GC has a tow bar, but I don't have a brake setup for it. It's 15 miles of hilly county roads. I had trouble getting my truck going on the incline in my gravel driveway because it's a 2wd and the gravel is a bit loose, but after that it felt basically ok. Stopping distances were longer than I really felt comfortable with, but I never felt like I was being shoved along either. My truck is a C-20 so it does have larger rear shoes than your 1/2 ton.

Bottom line I'd say this. Make sure the rear brakes are working on the truck. start by lifting the rear wheels off the ground, have someone press the brakes and see if you can turn the rear wheels, if you can it's probably a bad proportioning valve. you'd be surprised how much I've seen this on older trucks in the shop when someone complains that the brakes just don't seem to be stopping as well as they should. Then adjust the brakes, if your still uncomfortable, either tow less weight, or get brakes on the trailer. Be safe.

The trailer is a 3/4 ton truck bed, made into a trailer. frame, spring, shackles, box, topper. With a tongue and lights. Here Ill post a pic.

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The truck i pull with is actually a 1996 F150 with 300 inline 6. It does the pull part of trailering great, but this trailer doesnt have brakes. And the rears of truck are out of adjustment(for sure) and my question is more or less, notwithstanding trailer brakes, is there an adjustment to drum brakes that would help with my purpose? I will primarily only use the truck as backup driving or when pulling something, so adjusting it for pulling weight would be best in my opinion(if there is something to adjust).

I know the proper is a certain thickness away from drum surface while rotating freely(varies, I bet, but similar on most drum brake rear) and thats with no load. If expecting to add a load, could one adjust it in a way to make it better for a trailer?

I guess I should mention there is no ABS at play in this 1996, if that was a concern. Bone stock with things bypassed or removed that dont work. That included the ABS pump in the mid 2000s.

 

[GXPWeasel]

I'm not sure about the factory brakes on a '96 F-150. That's back before most of the half ton trucks advertised towing capabilities, and they didn't care nearly as much about brakes. What you could do, is get the rear brakes adjusted correctly, then upgrade the front brakes as much as possible. Power Stop is my choice, and aren't that much more expensive than stock replacements.

I added power stop brakes to my wife's Traverse which used to pull a 4k lb pop up camper, and now pulls a 4500lb boat. The difference is night and day from what was on there factory. I just replaced the front brake rotors and pads, no need on the rear (which are disc).

 

[Backfoot100]

There could be an issue with that trailer too.
I'm certainly no expert but I've pulled plenty of loads over the years with and without brakes.
If you're getting a push like you say on two different tow rigs you might want to be looking at that home made trailer.
What are the chances that the trailer axle isn't nice and perpendicular to the tongue? In other words, it naturally dog tracks while pulling. It could also make it a real bitch to try and back up too.
If that is the case, as soon as you hit the brakes and that axle isn't square to the tongue it'll want to push to one side which certainly sounds like your issue.
Brakes would definitely help but it could still be the root of your issue vs. the brakes on the tow rig.

 

[nabeshin]

Loose the Ford for a Chevy, lol.

But yeah, homemade trailers are iffy at best. My father-in-law has two, one is from an early 60's GMC truck, and the other is from a 50's International. (wish the rest of these trucks was still around) They don't pull worth a damn and are squirrely at best. Only used for short trips on gravel roads though.

 

[Turbo4whl]

Loose the Ford for a Chevy, lol.

But yeah, homemade trailers are iffy at best. My father-in-law has two, one is from an early 60's GMC truck, and the other is from a 50's International. (wish the rest of these trucks was still around) They don't pull worth a damn and are squirrely at best. Only used for short trips on gravel roads though.

You are right about the homemade trailers if they are not built correctly. I have built 3 trailers from truck frames and beds. If you just notch the frame rails and bend them together to make the "A" frame, you will notice a big difference in how the trailer responds. This puts the coupler much lower than the center of gravity of the rest of the trailer. This acts like a big lever and will wrench the back of the truck from side to side.

I was driving and pulling my 3/4 ton trailer with a 1/2 ton truck. I could really tell without trailer brakes how the trailer really was pushing the truck around more so than the other way. However, it felt like the rear doesnt... do its share and thus wants to push the back end out(the truck had at least 600 pounds of sand in bed, not thinking it was from no weight on rear wheels). Ive noticed it while generally driving, it seems like the truck wants to kick out left in the rear as if its not working as hard. I will be regularily pulling this trailer with a safe load(and ocassionally a trailer with a car on), is there a more aggressive setting I should set the rear brakes to or how do you guys approach that?

600 pounds of sand? That is less than 7, 90 pound bags of sand. They will not even cover the whole floor of the bed. You would be surprised how much a truck bed half full of sand weighs. Sand, gravel, fire wood and such loaded up to the top of a pickup bed is an overload, even for a 3/4 ton pickup.

Taylor, your '96 Ford rear brakes should still be enough to stop the trailer if it is not over loaded. Brake inspection and correct adjustment may be needed. I did add electric brakes to all 3 trailers I build. Yeah, I'm sure I have over loaded them!

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[nabeshin]

You are right about the homemade trailers if they are not built correctly. I have built 3 trailers from truck frames and beds. If you just notch the frame rails and bend them together to make the "A" frame, you will notice a big difference in how the trailer responds. This puts the coupler much lower than the center of gravity of the rest of the trailer. This acts like a big lever and will wrench the back of the truck from side to side.

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So notching the frame and making the A frame is bad? Never really looked too closely at how these were built.

 

[Turbo4whl]

So notching the frame and making the A frame is bad? Never really looked too closely at how these were built.

Yes, the trailer will handle much better with straight frame rails. I have built the both ways, bend the truck frame, this lowers the coupler, and cut off the truck frame and weld on straight rails. Better yet is to lower the trailer by flipping the axle to the top of the springs. Truck bed trailers are carrying the load much higher than the typical utility trailer.