700R4 or 4L60?

[Lewis]

Upon further inspection, I find the PO lied and I have a 305 c.i. engine with a 203 transfer case in my 1984 K10. The original 700R4 is toast and no remanufacturer or rebuilder will take it as a core. now, I am told that the newer the transmission I buy, the better. The recommendation is to buy a '90 or '91 4L60 (not the later 4L60E which is computer controlled) as a direct replacement. I have been told it is a plug & play exact replacement. What say you experts????
As always, your sage advice is greatly appreciated!

 

[Dutch Rutter]

Upon further inspection, I find the PO lied and I have a 305 c.i. engine with a 203 transfer case in my 1984 K10. The original 700R4 is toast and no remanufacturer will take it as a core. now, I am told that the newer the transmission I buy, the better. The recommendation is to buy a '90 or '91 4L60 (not the later 4L60E which is computer controlled) as a direct replacement. I have been told it is a plug & play exact replacement. What say you experts????
As always, your sage advice is greatly appreciated!

As someone who's had a 700r4 rebuilt a few times now.

Either get it rebuilt by some old crusty guy at a reputable transmission speciality shop. Or swap it out with something completely different (nv4500, 4l80e etc.).

imho, don't waste your time or money trying to deal with those online based rebuilding companies (monster transmissions etc.) They are more about shoveling transmissions out the door then they are about putting out a good and reliable product.

 

[Lewis]

Thanks, Dutch. The person who recommended the 4L60 is in fact a "crusty guy at a reputable transmission shop" here in Phoenix, AZ. He says the cost is about the same and it's a waste of money to rebuild the '84 700R4. one more thing, down the road, I plan on a warmed up 350 or small block 400.

 

[Doppleganger]

After reading so many horror stories from online big $$$ rebuilds, I had my '85 700 rebuilt by a local reputable little shop - one man show. Guy said most of the internals can be sourced from a 4L60 from as late as 2002. His brother has one in a 550hp Vette he races with in the summers and its going on 6 abused years doing just fine.

Cost me <$1000 and that included a new HD torque converter.

 

[Dutch Rutter]

Thanks, Dutch. The person who recommended the 4L60 is in fact a "crusty guy at a reputable transmission shop" here in Phoenix, AZ. He says the cost is about the same and it's a waste of money to rebuild the '84 700R4. one more thing, down the road, I plan on a warmed up 350 or small block 400.

Good deal. Personally, I'm not too sure on the differences between the years. I have heard the same as you, in that the newer is supposed to be the better, but I've never got much detail past that. @Matt69olds and many others are very knowledgeable about these trans and will probably chime in.

From my understanding, the 4l60 and the 700r4 are the same transmission. Through the years of production they did make some internal changes/improvements to them. So as far as being plug and play. Yes, they will interchange pretty flawlessly.

 

[AuroraGirl]

in 1990 GM changed the names of their transmissions from TH400 to 3l80, 440-t4 to 4t60, 700r4 to 4l60, etc you name it. The name change did include across multiple areas changes from the previous year, ie, a 700r4, but they are still the same transmission.

1991 electronic controls were introduced and you could get a 4l60e, which is different in many ways, but shares many hard parts. you also saw 4l80e, 4t60e, etc be introduced. a coupleyears later, the 4l80e of fwds, the 4t80e, came into production as well but it was only 93 or 94

 

[JoeR Jr]

For me, it is the 1987 and newer TH700. GM made a bunch of changes to them by then, including the auxiliary valve body, and they had a good chance of survival if you built them right. I don't like to build anything older than that.
Joe

 

[yevgenievich]

Aux valve body 87+. Starting in 89 some had electric speedometer

 

[Matt69olds]

The best cores are the ones with the St Louis Arch shaped casting line on the passenger side of the case, just above the servo. The later the model year, generally the better.

Many of the durability upgrades from the 4L60E will work with a older non electronic 700. Things like the upgraded 3-4 (assuming you also use the updated piston) bearing upgrades (have to use the updated part the bearing rides on) upgrade sprag assembly, factory 5 pinion carriers, etc

 

[cstew47]

For me, it is the 1987 and newer TH700. GM made a bunch of changes to them by then, including the auxiliary valve body, and they had a good chance of survival if you built them right. I don't like to build anything older than that.
Jo

 

[Jeff w Ashworth]

I bought a 1994 4l60e and going to have it rebuilt, an old timer told me the parts for the 700r4's and older transmission's are getting hard to find so it would be better to get newer year transmission for my 86 GMC 4x4, the reason I looked around is so I could find one that bolted to my transfer case adapter with the 4 bolt like a turbo 350 or 700r4 and in the long run will be better for me.

 

[Bextreme04]

I bought a 1994 4l60e and going to have it rebuilt, an old timer told me the parts for the 700r4's and older transmission's are getting hard to find so it would be better to get newer year transmission for my 86 GMC 4x4, the reason I looked around is so I could find one that bolted to my transfer case adapter with the 4 bolt like a turbo 350 or 700r4 and in the long run will be better for me.

The only problem with that is that you will need some kind of trans controller to run it.

 

[AuroraGirl]

The best cores are the ones with the St Louis Arch shaped casting line on the passenger side of the case, just above the servo. The later the model year, generally the better.

Many of the durability upgrades from the 4L60E will work with a older non electronic 700. Things like the upgraded 3-4 (assuming you also use the updated piston) bearing upgrades (have to use the updated part the bearing rides on) upgrade sprag assembly, factory 5 pinion carriers, etc

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yum

 

[Soundmound]

yum

In the import world they call that an SMOD! (Strawberry Milkshake Of Death) My wife's Pilot was headed that way but I caught it before the trans cooler failed.
Personally I am leaning hard towards a built 700r4 from bowtieoverdrives.com when the time comes. That is unless I start getting horror stories from the community about them. Once upon a time I was ASE certified in transmission rebuilding, I was like 18 and learned quickly that path was not for me.

 

[AuroraGirl]

In the import world they call that an SMOD! (Strawberry Milkshake Of Death) My wife's Pilot was headed that way but I caught it before the trans cooler failed.
Personally I am leaning hard towards a built 700r4 from bowtieoverdrives.com when the time comes. That is unless I start getting horror stories from the community about them. Once upon a time I was ASE certified in transmission rebuilding, I was like 18 and learned quickly that path was not for me.

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mind you the fluid you saw was fresh fluid by like a couple weeks before that at most, and the filter/ and pan were clean and fresh

The dark tint of the fluid is wear stuffs from excess what you see here I think, and then the "uh oh" part you may think is water or coolant, but its just air. it was overfilled and the fluid was getting smacked like a battered woman with an abusive husband whos pissy kinda smacked
I also used the cooler lines to drain the transmission a little more than just pull off and let it drain, I ran the engine short bursts after the pan stuffs all stopped because I wanted to get anything that would come out with it

like the bits of metal and the contents of that bucket lol... also used the transmission to pump out the cooler both ways, spit out some $$ things too