Valve seals for camel hump heads?

[Ricko1966]

That’s a wonderful question. I bought the truck with a rebuilt 327/350hp just put in it with nothing hooked up.
Except it’s not a 327, block says 350. So I asked the guy I bought it from about that and he came clean that he didn’t rebuild it, that it was purchased already rebuilt.

So at this point all bets are off. The lower end was rebuilt- a scope revealed fresh crosshatches in the cylinders and a .030 stamped in the piston. But as far as the heads, they could’ve been slapped on there with just fresh orange paint. I have somewhat low expectations at this point because a lot of things he said it was, it isn’t. And he himself had no actual clue as to what he’d bought.

You can build a 327 out of a 350 block,same bore,different stroke. You can also build a 302,or a 383 just change cranks and pistons. Or crank and rods. To clear up any confusion I may start if you put in a crank with 1/4 inch less stroke the pistons will park too far down in the bore,so you have to use longer rods or different pin height pistons. If you put in a crank with more stroke,the pistons will pop up out of the bores,so you need shorter rods or different pistons.

 

[ChuckN]

You can build a 327 out of a 350 block,same bore,different stroke. You can also build a 302,or a 383 just change cranks and pistons. Or crank and rods. To clear up any confusion I may start if you put in a crank with 1/4 inch less stroke the pistons will park to far down in the bore,so you have to use longer rods or different pin height pistons. If you put in a crank with more stroke,the pistons will pop up out of the bores,so you need shorter rods or different pistons.

Oh yeah, I’m aware of the different configurations. It’s entirely unlikely that someone would spend all the dough to convert it from a 350 to a 327 from a generic mid 70s 350 truck block. My money is on this guy was sold a “327/350hp” and someone put a set of camel hump heads on a 350 to give it that appearance. No matter, I wouldn’t be able to measure the stroke accurately without pulling the heads anyway.

 

[Ricko1966]

Oh yeah, I’m aware of the different configurations. It’s entirely unlikely that someone would spend all the dough to convert it from a 350 to a 327 from a generic mid 70s 350 truck block. My money is on this guy was sold a “327/350hp” and someone put a set of camel hump heads on a 350 to give it that appearance. No matter, I wouldn’t be able to measure the stroke accurately without pulling the heads anyway.

Well he had 327 heads,he may have had a fresh 327 with a cracked block. I had a super,super low mile 350 with all the good stuff in it,but the block was busted in the lifter bores. I traded a friend a good 400 block for a good 350 block so I could fix the 350 and he could build a 377

 

[ChuckN]

Compression test done. Pretty good results- all are north of 170 with the highest being 182.

 

[Rickf]

ARF 180cc or 195cc heads are around $2100 for a pair, (from their website) what's a valve job with seats, guides & cc'd for older heads go for? Might not be that much more

 

[ChuckN]

ARF 180cc or 195cc heads are around $2100 for a pair, (from their website) what's a valve job with seats, guides & cc'd for older heads go for? Might not be that much more

They have a more budget line (I saw your suggestion as well) for 625$ a head without the bells and whistles. The only thing I’d have to do is change the springs since they’re made for roller lifters.

 

[ChuckN]

@Rickf

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Part of the reason of taking off the valve springs today was the hope that a machine shop could measure the spring pressure to tell me if they’re stock or not- he said he couldn’t because he couldn’t tell what the installed height was supposed to be. He recommended just getting a set of springs that I want if I was concerned so I could be sure. So I’m just gonna drive the damn thing until the seals arrive.

 

[MikeB]

But more to your point- if they start looking pretty suspect, I have no problem dipping into my savings and getting a set of budget line AFR heads for it.

So, their "budget priced" Enforcer heads are now are now $1,250/pair. And how about their Street Heads for $2,066/pair? Doesn't seem that long ago when we thought $1,000 was a lot of money for what they now call Street Heads. My retirement income simply can't keep up!

 

[Bennyt]

They have a more budget line (I saw your suggestion as well) for 625$ a head without the bells and whistles. The only thing I’d have to do is change the springs since they’re made for roller lifters.

If you go the route of new heads...some vendors order the heads in various stages from the manufacturers and finish them off to the buyers needs so it may not cost anything extra to get the spring rate you need. While it's been a long time since I was in the industry, it was common for us to swap springs, drill steam holes, etc. at no charge for the customer.

 

[idahovette]

NOT many places that do anything "extra" for the customer any more?.......production out the door!!!!!!

 

[ChuckN]

If you go the route of new heads...some vendors order the heads in various stages from the manufacturers and finish them off to the buyers needs so it may not cost anything extra to get the spring rate you need. While it's been a long time since I was in the industry, it was common for us to swap springs, drill steam holes, etc. at no charge for the customer.

Good info- thanks!

 

[ChuckN]

So, their "budget priced" Enforcer heads are now are now $1,250/pair. And how about their Street Heads for $2,066/pair? Doesn't seem that long ago when we thought $1,000 was a lot of money for what they now call Street Heads. My retirement income simply can't keep up!

Yep, I hear ya. The true typical “budget” option would be vortec heads, but then by the time I got them machined for bigger lift, better springs, new intake manifold etc, there goes the “budget “ option.

There’s lots of cheap junk aluminum heads out there that are Fleabay specials but I would be surprised if I didn’t spend the difference making them right.

 

[Ricko1966]

Chuck when you get the springs off try to rock the valves in the guides,if they are old double humps without recent work the valves will wobble crazy in the guides if they have barely noticeable wobble,the guides are tight,if somebody did guides,they had to cut seats, if the the guides feel good I would assume the guy was trying to build a decent motor and would assume he used springs to match the cam.

 

[ChuckN]

Chuck when you get the springs off try to rock the valves in the guides,if they are old double humps without recent work the valves will wobble crazy in the guides if they have barely noticeable wobble,the guides are tight,if somebody did guides,they had to cut seats, if the the guides feel good I would assume the guy was trying to build a decent motor and would assume he used springs to match the cam.

Cool, good info.

 

[JBswth]

But more to your point- if they start looking pretty suspect, I have no problem dipping into my savings and getting a set of budget line AFR heads for it. One thing I’m going to do is when I have the rockers off, put a straight edge along the top of the valves and see if they’re pretty even- if not, I’ll know I have sunken seats.

And sunken seats are often a sign of pre-unleaded heads being run on unleaded gas for an extended period of time - the valve and seat pound each other way, little by little.

J. B.