Neutral switch replacement/adjust help needed

[mtnmankev]

I'm still fighting with my 84 K10.
The truck starts normal in park, and I can make the shifter adjustment in hopes of relieving the issue I have where I gotta lift up past park in order to turn the key fully to start the truck.
Here's my problem:
I only have backup lights when I am in neutral or drive. And if I'm in drive, that'll get me stopped by the road nazis for having a white light showing to the rear.
I looked at my present switch real good, even with a flashlight, and I don't see any screws to remove in order to get the old switch off.
And I bought the Chevy shop manual CD which wasn't any help.
The shop manual has one short paragraph with confusing instructions, and when I go to the diagram they claim is for the switch, it's for a completely different part of the truck. They lied to me. Nowhere is there a picture of the switch and how it mounts.
Can somebody please help me with this task ?
I need explicit instructions to follow.
And a good pic would be wonderful !!
Many thanks in advance.

 

[mtnmankev]

Here's another tidbit to ponder ......
I took a flashlight and a small inspection mirror (with the adjustable head on it) and looked all around the switch. I don't see any mounting screws and no holes for any if they existed.
The switch will jiggle a little forward/backwards.
Maybe it is just sitting there waiting for me to pry the living hell out of it in order to slide it off the steering column.
No room to swing a hammer to get it off .......

 

[GTME94]

I'm not sure how to remove the switch but it is adjustable. You can push it either clockwise or counter-clockwise to get it adjusted. It will make a scratchy ratcheting sound as you move it.

My truck started fine but the reverse lights would only come on if I pulled up the gear shift lever when it was in reverse. So with the engine off, I put it in Neutral and then moved the switch several "clicks" clockwise, then I put it back into Park. If you move it too far it will re-set itself as you shift into Park. Mine works fine now.

 

[MadOgre]

K before adjusting it put your transmission in neutral. go under neath and remove the bolt and shift lever to transmission then go to your steering column and move the column shifter to neutral so that it engages the lock it will not go up or down with out pulling forward on the lever . this is neutral on the column, it may not line up with the gear indicator, not to worry. reattach the shift linkage to the transmission. remove dash bezel and adjust the indicator cable by moving the clip on the column this will adjust where the indicator needle sits. After having done all that if you still have the same problem then turn your attention to the neutral switch

 

[MadOgre]

Often times this problem has nothing to do with the neutral switch at all.

 

[mtnmankev]

Another issue the truck has is in the winter when it gets really cold.
Despite pulling up on the shifter to allow it to start, the truck won't crank, I suspect either a switch has grease in it that gets too thick, or there is something gummed up on a linkage.
I am going to take the column apart, replace a few parts, and do a thorough clean and gentle lube.
I depend on having two pickups here that I can just fire up and drive when needed.

 

[MadOgre]

Another issue the truck has is in the winter when it gets really cold.
Despite pulling up on the shifter to allow it to start, the truck won't crank, I suspect either a switch has grease in it that gets too thick, or there is something gummed up on a linkage.
I am going to take the column apart, replace a few parts, and do a thorough clean and gentle lube.
I depend on having two pickups here that I can just fire up and drive when needed.

Did you adjust as to steps out lined above?

 

[mtnmankev]

I might tackle it in the morning when it's cool, it's too dad-blamed hot outside right now to tinker with it, plus I made a trip to the big city today to shop and that sorta wore me out.

 

[MadOgre]

I might tackle it in the morning when it's cool, it's too dad-blamed hot outside right now to tinker with it, plus I made a trip to the big city today to shop and that sorta wore me out.

lol I hear ya.

Im willing to bet if you adjust it like I say that your problems will disappear even in cold weather.

 

[mtnmankev]

Okay, I adjusted the shift linkage, no change.
I bought a new neutral switch at the parts store yesterday, pix below are what they sold me for 84 K10 automatic tranny non tilt column. BWD part no: S9168
End view and top view.
It has three more terminals than my current switch. I circled the terminals my switch and the new one have in common.
Now, according to the GM factory shop manual for the truck, I am supposed to remove 2 screws to get the old switch off.
NOWHERE on either the old switch or new one are there any screws or screw holes.
And no brackets from the steering column holding the switch in place.
How the hell do I get the old switch off ??

 

[mtnmankev]

Additional note:
If, in theory, one wire completes the circuit to ground for neutral start, and the other does the same for the back up lights, how does the power get to ground when the switch is all plastic and there is no third connector going to ground?
There are only the two wires, light green and a dark blue.
Just for giggles, I unplugged the connector, lifted up on the shifter above the Park position and turned the key. The truck started.
I decided I now have two choices.
Rebuild the steering column with a new ignition switch, replace the parts that the key lock activates mechanically, and lube the crap out of all the moving parts.
Or, remove the steering column from the truck, use a hammer, and break the switch off the column. I bet it'll come off with a hammer. Figure out how the new switch mounts and start rewiring everything .
I can mount a toggle switch for the backup lights, and since my foot is always on the brake anyway when I start any of my trucks, the neutral switch is a useless item and I can take the new switch back for a refund.

 

[chengny]

As you already found out, there is no NSS on your truck, it has a mechanical start neutral lockout in the column. Try twisting the key to start - with the gear select lever in any position other than P or N - you can't do it (or shouldn't be able to):

You must be registered for see images attach

On some automatic transmission equipped vehicles, the actuation of the ignition switch is prevented by a mechanical lockout system, Fig. 12, which prevents the lock cylinder from rotating when the selector lever is out of Park or Neutral. When the selector lever is in Park or Neutral, the slots in the bowl plate and the finger on the actuator rod align, allowing the finger to pass through the bowl plate, in turn actuating the ignition switch, Fig. 12. If the selector lever is in any position other than Park or Neutral, the finger contacts the bowl plate when the lock cylinder is rotated, thereby preventing full travel of the lock cylinder.


The light green and dark blue wires on the column switch assembly are for the back up lights. Connect to D & E stabs on the switch on the right:

You must be registered for see images attach

Here is the R & R procedure (and adjustment) for the switch:

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[mtnmankev]

THANK YOU for posting that, I will try once again to remove the switch.
Maybe I will have backup lights only in reverse now and will save me from drilling holes in the dash to mount a toggle switch.
As for the start blocks in the steering column, only the Park notch will allow a start. In neutral, the key turns enough to where one would swear the truck would start, but get nothing. Put in park and it turns nice and smooth and starts easily without having to pull up on the shifter lever.

I think I have weird truck, or maybe it is possessed by space aliens .........

 

[chengny]

Before you even try to pull that switch - it is not as easy as they make it sound - read this:

I am guessing that since you can get the lights to come on, by lifting up on the gear shift lever, that you have a neutral safety/back-up light switch. It should be column mounted and right up against the firewall. Correct?


At one point a few years ago I was having the same trouble as you. It was not really an issue - until you have to keep upward pressure on the shift lever while trying to back down a steep dark driveway in the middle of the woods.

So I decided to at least look at the switch. Often that's as far as I get.


This time however, I fixed it. Took about 2 minutes and zero dollars.

While I was poking at one side with my finger, the whole switch made a ratcheting sound and rotated around the steering column. Seems that the plastic housing (switch open/close point) is infinitely adjustable.

It might take awhile to figure out but basically put your gear shift in R and then (with the key on) have someone watch the back-up lights. Push the switch one way or the other - I forget - until the back-ups come on.

 

[MadOgre]

As you already found out, there is no NSS on your truck, it has a mechanical start neutral lockout in the column. Try twisting the key to start - with the gear select lever in any position other than P or N - you can't do it (or shouldn't be able to):

You must be registered for see images attach

On some automatic transmission equipped vehicles, the actuation of the ignition switch is prevented by a mechanical lockout system, Fig. 12, which prevents the lock cylinder from rotating when the selector lever is out of Park or Neutral. When the selector lever is in Park or Neutral, the slots in the bowl plate and the finger on the actuator rod align, allowing the finger to pass through the bowl plate, in turn actuating the ignition switch, Fig. 12. If the selector lever is in any position other than Park or Neutral, the finger contacts the bowl plate when the lock cylinder is rotated, thereby preventing full travel of the lock cylinder.


The light green and dark blue wires on the column switch assembly are for the back up lights. Connect to D & E stabs on the switch on the right:

You must be registered for see images attach

Here is the R & R procedure (and adjustment) for the switch:

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

You sure do come up with some amazing stuff from time to time! Hats off to you my friend