2002 - 4.8L to 5.3L or should I go to a 5.7L?

[dougbert]

Last year after starting my build thread on my 84 K1500 in this forum (see signature link), I noticed I should have put the build thread somewhere else (I assume anyway) as this posting area was dealing with the Engine swap subjects and the like, and not full builds.

Well I have started a long term LS build up that fits more in this container.

I picked up a 2002 Silverado 4.8L (LR4) with 147k miles on it from a local (salt lake city) salvage yard for $400 (down from $465 when they could not find the MAF sensor). Can't have too many engines.

Don't have a vehicle in mind yet to put it into (maybe a 1987 suburban), BUT I have some thoughts on what mods I want to do this engine in the name of fun. I could leave it as a 4.8L but I want some practice on building a High output engine, so at least I am going to convert the block to 5.3L. This entails swapping the crankshaft, new con-rods and new pistons. And instead of pressed fit wrist pins I want floating wrist pins

Yes, I could just go buy a 5.3L for $700 to $1000 here now, but my desire is to practice (like I said) on engine modifications on the LS.

I have a 2004 5.3L crankshaft I picked up for $60. I have floating wrist pin Gen IV connecting rods (new OEM $200) for the build (.945 dia wrist pins) and now I have the engine. Pistons are yet to come, depending on which bore out I do.

This engine has 862 heads, but I have a pair of 862 heads I am in the process of porting and installing 2" intake valves and spring, etc upgrades. So I will use my heads.

Sure the 5.3L could have power, but am now ready to build a 5.7 iron LS engine, NA and generate some power I never have had before and learn in the process. With the HPTuners package I look forward to learning how to tune it or blow it up in my mistakes.

Pics at yard pickup and taking the accessories off. Next step will be to clean the outside. As per Mark Burch (aka AGearHead4Life on youtube and facebook) I will use Purple Power and a Hi-pressure washer to clean the outside. I have released all the valves by loosening the rockers thus closing all valves and protecting the cylinders from water then putting the covers back on. I will plug the various holes/vents and clean it on a engine stand.

If this is interesting to others I will continue on it over time - which will be many months

dougbert

 

[throttle out]

Did you bite the Bullet and buy the full HP tuners software? If so, I'm jealous lol!

I'm signed up for this one Doug, Look forward to seeing the progress and helping in any way. My 5.3 has been running awesome but I'm still on the factory tune and have LT headers, custom (by me) 3" dual magnaflow exhaust, and a cold air intake. I know a tune would wake it up, but am gonna wait for a cam swap, 4.8 pistons, and a turbo, so your build is relative for me!!
Your build documentation is, in my book second to very few and am looking forward to this.

Good luck, and give it hell!!!!!

 

[throttle out]

Here is a current pic of mine for inspiration lol!!

 

[dougbert]

thank you throttle, I appreciate it. Your engine looks great. BTW, did you stay automatic transmission? I went NV4500 and have found that the hydraulic clutch slave is in the way for my long tube header on the DS. Will fully install the slave and see where things are at.



Yes I bought the HPTuners through TheTuningSchool

The following link is the package I got: http://www.thetuningschool.com/product/shop-owner-gm-tuning-package/

steep yes, but I am serious about learning how to do this myself. It contains the HPTuning product, Level I GM at home training program and the shop product (with Broadband O2 sensors, etc)

Over the weekend I cleaned the outside of the 4.8L engine, this morning I did another coat of degreaser, Purple Power. I am going to buy some Zep 505 industrial cleaner from Home Depot and see if that will attack some harder dirt sections.

Here are pics as of this morning (I do this in the morning before going to work and then work into the evening at work with AC and not fight the heat outside) - seems the pics are not as clear and they usually are.

The last pic is Jake's 4.8L I picked up at the same time as mine. It is at jake's shop and parking where my rigs are at.

Here is the link to Mark Burch's method of cleaning: https://www.facebook.com/AGearHead4Life/photos/?tab=album&album_id=901268526593443&hc_location=ufi

NOTE: In taking all the outer stuff of the engine, I found 3 broken coils. Darn.

last pic is of Jake's 4.8L - its his place I am working on this and the truck


dougbert

 

[throttle out]

I stuck with my 700R4 temporarily and am currently gathering all the parts to build my 4L60E. I also scored a 241c passenger drop T-case locally.
Nice score on the HP Tuner! I'm considering EFI Live because I can also tune my Duramax when the time comes.
Sammy

 

[dougbert]

This first pic is after cleaning with purple power cleaner, but before using the Zep Fast 505 cleaner and before attacking the engine with the power washer (before it quit). All those black marks on the face of the head intake runners are now gone. Should have taken a pic after.

After it is cleaned and painted, I will clean the intake, and other outer parts and re-assemble. THEN will build the starting stand frame and finally start the critter up.

I will now show the car I aim to put this engine into: a 1983 Caprice Classic with 101kmiles on it (with a 700r4 transmission) and it cost $450.

Very clean body especially considering it came from New Jersey. 84 yo man was on a trip from NJ to California. Had repairs done in Denver (new fuel tank, partial new exhaust, new water pump, new AC compressor, some hoses). Then on the return trip to NJ while approaching Salt Lake City blew a head gasket. Radiator had been leaking (and it is plugged with deposits). So the guy sold it to a Goodyear repair station who advertised it after getting the title and that day I saw it, I bought it.

Plan is to repair the head gasket(s) and replace the radiator and run it as is until the engine is done (after the winter). Goal is a high horsepower engine to put in this beauty of a car as a sleeper. I know its not a truck, but it is of that era. The guy MUST have had it in the garage most of the time. Image 3,000 miles a year, and clean (well bottom inside of doors have issues, but I can put Chassis saver on those). The car could not handle the long trip because of lack of preventative maintenance. The passenger door is missing a chrome piece, but other than that, nice looking. Interior is awesome

Anyway, this thread will deal mostly with the 4.8 enhancement. Just wanted to share where the engine is going to end up in.

thinking of using the 700r4 for awhile, then maybe a 4l80 after I blow up the 700r4 -- I mean can it handle 500+ hp???? Right?


Throttleout - I will have the 4.8 Pistons available after tearing into it this winter and will be selling them. Interested? Price at this time - dunno yet


dougbert

 

[foamypirate]

That Caprice is sweet! I've got the itch to swap an LQ9 6.0L into my 91' Caprice to add a bit of power. After driving my 3/4 ton crewcab with a 6.0L, I'm a bit spoiled now. The Caprice feels way underpowered. Definitely looking forward to your progress!

 

[dougbert]

That Caprice is sweet! I've got the itch to swap an LQ9 6.0L into my 91' Caprice to add a bit of power. After driving my 3/4 ton crewcab with a 6.0L, I'm a bit spoiled now. The Caprice feels way underpowered. Definitely looking forward to your progress!

Found a LS into caprice conversion web site: http://www.brphotrods.com/products/77-90 B body products/

and thx for the support. The PU comes first to finish though. LQ9s sounds like a plan, though expensive

 

[throttle out]

This first pic is after cleaning with purple power cleaner, but before using the Zep Fast 505 cleaner and before attacking the engine with the power washer (before it quit). All those black marks on the face of the head intake runners are now gone. Should have taken a pic after.

After it is cleaned and painted, I will clean the intake, and other outer parts and re-assemble. THEN will build the starting stand frame and finally start the critter up.

I will now show the car I aim to put this engine into: a 1983 Caprice Classic with 101kmiles on it (with a 700r4 transmission) and it cost $450.

Very clean body especially considering it came from New Jersey. 84 yo man was on a trip from NJ to California. Had repairs done in Denver (new fuel tank, partial new exhaust, new water pump, new AC compressor, some hoses). Then on the return trip to NJ while approaching Salt Lake City blew a head gasket. Radiator had been leaking (and it is plugged with deposits). So the guy sold it to a Goodyear repair station who advertised it after getting the title and that day I saw it, I bought it.

Plan is to repair the head gasket(s) and replace the radiator and run it as is until the engine is done (after the winter). Goal is a high horsepower engine to put in this beauty of a car as a sleeper. I know its not a truck, but it is of that era. The guy MUST have had it in the garage most of the time. Image 3,000 miles a year, and clean (well bottom inside of doors have issues, but I can put Chassis saver on those). The car could not handle the long trip because of lack of preventative maintenance. The passenger door is missing a chrome piece, but other than that, nice looking. Interior is awesome

Anyway, this thread will deal mostly with the 4.8 enhancement. Just wanted to share where the engine is going to end up in.

thinking of using the 700r4 for awhile, then maybe a 4l80 after I blow up the 700r4 -- I mean can it handle 500+ hp???? Right?


Throttleout - I will have the 4.8 Pistons available after tearing into it this winter and will be selling them. Interested? Price at this time - dunno yet


dougbert

I would be interested in the piston, rod, bearing, & cap assemblies for sure.
Let me know when you are getting ready and have a price point. Thanks Doug!

 

[dougbert]

I would be interested in the piston, rod, bearing, & cap assemblies for sure.
Let me know when you are getting ready and have a price point. Thanks Doug!

Time factor will in the winter, when I will work inside the shop and warm (this shop has a Nat Gas heater) and less time available outside on the trucks (hopefully the PU will be going soon).

As for price, that has been difficult to determine. I don't want to gouge but desire a fair price. I have not seen 4.8L pistons (used) on ebay ..... until today.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BJ035-2001-...ash=item1ea270d92f:g:5YcAAOSw3ydVxnrA&vxp=mtr

as reference. $50 a piston, which is $400 for a set.

I was looking at $200 + $25 for shipping, for all 8 pistons, rods, old bearings, rings, caps. We can start there

My plan in the short term is to use a starting stand and test out the engine after cleaning, to ensure things are going well before tearing into it.

dougbert

 

[dougbert]

Engine cleaned up and then painted this morning with a 1st coat

 

[throttle out]

Time factor will in the winter, when I will work inside the shop and warm (this shop has a Nat Gas heater) and less time available outside on the trucks (hopefully the PU will be going soon).

As for price, that has been difficult to determine. I don't want to gouge but desire a fair price. I have not seen 4.8L pistons (used) on ebay ..... until today.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BJ035-2001-...ash=item1ea270d92f:g:5YcAAOSw3ydVxnrA&vxp=mtr

as reference. $50 a piston, which is $400 for a set.

I was looking at $200 + $25 for shipping, for all 8 pistons, rods, old bearings, rings, caps. We can start there

My plan in the short term is to use a starting stand and test out the engine after cleaning, to ensure things are going well before tearing into it.

dougbert

That is a fair price dougbert! A bit tough for me to swallow currently though as I gave $300 for my complete 5.3. I see the listing you used as a reference point and understand where your coming from, however was guessing $50-$100 would get it done.

 

[MikeB]

I think it's pretty cool that you're jumping in the the LS game. Last year I helped a friend put together what started out as a 97 LS1. We ended up having local shop Thompson Motorsports power hone the cylinders to +.004" oversize, and let them assemble the short block using stock crank & rods with aftermarket forged pistons (all balanced, of course).

We took the short block and went from there using LS6 heads, beehive valve springs, Z06 cam, and the latest spec lifters (which are slightly taller than earlier lifters, necessitating shorter pushrods for proper pre-load). Ended up using a Holley oil pan for clearance in his 55 Chevy convertible, along with Holley accessory brackets and cast iron exhaust manifolds. All the Holley stuff seems first rate.

Anyway, I was tempted to go the 5.3 route in my 82 C10 after removing the very tired 250 six, but got scared away by the cost of all the external stuff from oil pan to headers to electronics. But one of these days....

 

[dougbert]

That is a fair price dougbert! A bit tough for me to swallow currently though as I gave $300 for my complete 5.3. I see the listing you used as a reference point and understand where your coming from, however was guessing $50-$100 would get it done.

I understand. Several months before they are out of the block. See below. Great score on the 5.3!!!!

I think it's pretty cool that you're jumping in the the LS game. Last year I helped a friend put together what started out as a 97 LS1. We ended up having local shop Thompson Motorsports power hone the cylinders to +.004" oversize, and let them assemble the short block using stock crank & rods with aftermarket forged pistons (all balanced, of course).

We took the short block and went from there using LS6 heads, beehive valve springs, Z06 cam, and the latest spec lifters (which are slightly taller than earlier lifters, necessitating shorter pushrods for proper pre-load). Ended up using a Holley oil pan for clearance in his 55 Chevy convertible, along with Holley accessory brackets and cast iron exhaust manifolds. All the Holley stuff seems first rate.

Anyway, I was tempted to go the 5.3 route in my 82 C10 after removing the very tired 250 six, but got scared away by the cost of all the external stuff from oil pan to headers to electronics. But one of these days....

There are 2 ways to use a 5.3L: 1) as is and drop it in without any, what I call, "renewing". 2) Renew it with updated parts, with more beef parts and other needed parts.

Renewing the 5.3L swap into my K1500 (in another thread here) has cost about $3000. This Caprice swap is now targeted at $4k, as I also new a new pan, ordered a used LS6 intake ($350 right there, but comes with injectors and fuel rails), headers, etc, etc, etc

But this compares to my first build, a 1986 Land Cruiser whose power train ran me $9000 - yeah, I got the "good parts" syndrome. But I view that build as tuition to not do a SBC again.

Note my goals for these vehicles is that I want them run another 30 years (then I will be 90) and use them during that time. I want them do what I want. For years I have had to "settle" for what came along, since I raised 6 kids, and then their mother decided to leave. Well, all that is gone, and I have some more freedom. Each much decide what they want do WITH what resources they have.

So in a few months when I get the pistons out, we can re-visit it.

One thing I do is cash flow parts, and pick up a few here and then a few there over time. Been 8 years since I got the Land Cruiser

dougbert

 

[dougbert]

Re-Assembling the cleaned parts and new items for the start stand demo

I am not a photographer. I held the camera steady but still get blurry pics

Yes, the ECU will fit on TOP of the intake for the Start Stand

Link to my dropbox spreadsheet doc for this build

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hvml73mmgat1f7l/1983 caprice build.ods?dl=0

Black items are parts I have bought
Green items are parts for the complete rebuild
redish/orange items are parts needed for the starting stand to work


dougbert