Still Super Sloppy Steering

[Jon Karnes]

I have an 87 3/4 ton suburban 4wd. I did an engine and trans swap for a 5.9 12 valve and 47RH. Love this truck. I built it to be a daily driver commute vehicle. That said, the steering on it is really sloppy. When I had the swap done, they rebuilt the entire front end. New springs, every bushing replaced, all new ball joints, and all new bearings. Basically everything that could be replaced was replaced. Also a faster ratio gear box. I got a local shop to adjust the steering box about 1/4 turn and that took a bit of the slop out with out making it too twitchy. But then I went and put those bigger tires on it and it's back to being all over the place with about 4 to 5 inches of play in the wheel. It's so bad now that it feels dangerous over 50 mph. The guy that did the build said it's just the way these 3/4 ton 4wds are, that they had a lot of slop even when they were new. With modern tech, there has to be a way to be able to drive at 70 mph and be safe. Any suggestions are welcome. I've heard some say that a steering stabilizer will help. I don't see how, it doesn't jerk out of my hand and I don't see how that would remove the play from the wheel. I don't know enough to even know where to begin. Please help!!!!

 

[Jrgunn5150]

They didn't have alot of slop new, hell I've had some that were old and were fine. Seems like you've basically narrowed it yourself to the steering box.

Most rebuilders don't do anything to the boxes but put new seals in them and paint them. I'd look to a company like Redhead Steering or PSC for an actual new one.

 

[1987 GMC Jimmy]

You’re gonna have to jack up the front end and shake the wheels at the 3 and 9 o’clock positions with the steering wheel locked to see if something’s screwed up with tie rod ends, drag link ends, or Pitman arm. You’ll feel it wobble if there is, and if it’s really bad, you’ll also hear a clunk. If all that’s new, though, I wouldn’t expect a problem. You should also watch your steering box input and output while someone turns the wheel to make sure your new box isn’t a dud. It’s not unheard of for that to happen, and that’s what it sounds like to me. Finally, I’d consider doing the Cherokee int. steering shaft swap from a 1984-96 Cherokee. It gets rid of the rag joint and noticeably tightens up the steering. That’s ******** about them being super sloppy from the factory. They’re actually pretty decent when everything’s working right, plus the XJ shaft swap.

 

[Frankenchevy]

The 12v is much heavier than the gas v8 that came in it. That being said, it should be resprung to accommodate. You say all the stuff in the front end is new? Being that the steer box is brand new and everything is new in the front end, actual play in the steering is weird. I don’t have much play in mine at all. My diesel excursion has more play and it’s 30 years newer. What load range tires are you running? Sounds like the toe angle may be too open, maybe old tires...

I’d stick to load range d or e on tires with a Cummins hanging off the front.

Then again this might be what the forum elders are referring to with the “I’m new to old trucks, mine has sloppy steering” post patterns.

Hope you get it sorted. A Cummins swapped burbo will be awesome.

 

[Jon Karnes]

I’m really starting to lean towards steering shaft based on what y’all have said and what I’ve read in other threads. Here’s why.

It’s funny that you said redhead steering box, because that’s the brand he put in it according to the invoice. Guess great minds think alike huh?

As far as the springs go, they are brand new gm HD springs (4 leaf). Based on how stiff it is, it may actually be a little over sprung.

I took it to a 4x4 specialty shop. They put it up on their lift and checked everything in front of me. The alignment is dead on. They measured it with their optical machine and mechanical instruments. The thing is perfect. There is zero wobble or clunk in those ball joints and bearings when you push pull at 3 and nine. Tie rod ends, pitman arm, and all that stuff is brand new. Did visually check the input of the shaft when you move the wheel, and it’s money. Nothing there. He even checked it manually. (By the way, screw that. I ain’t putting my hands anywhere near moving gears just to be sure. That’s what my eyes are for)

The most we could see was that there is a hair of flex in the ball joint in front of the driver side tire before the tire moves when it’s on the ground. But just a hair. None when it’s jacked up.

The tires are only 5 days old. They are e class K02s. The play does feel worse now that the bigger tires are on there. They are 3.4 inches taller than the previous tires, so it seems to be magnifying the issue.

Plus I don’t see anything in this six page invoice that mentions the steering shaft. So it must be that right. I can’t think of anything else it could be.

I know it’s a newbie question, but I got to ask. In regards to the Cherokee shaft replacement. The original shafts are the same on 3/4 and half tons right?

 

[Jon Karnes]

Thank you for your ideas so far. You have no idea how much I appreciate it.

 

[1987 GMC Jimmy]

Those shafts go on most of the 79-96 trucks, body-on-frame cars, F Bodies, etc. Very universal for GM stuff of that vintage.

 

[shiftpro]

Then again this might be what the forum elders are referring to with the “I’m new to old trucks, mine has sloppy steering” post patterns.

And how many 'loose steering' threads are going now?

 

[Jrgunn5150]

Plus I don’t see anything in this six page invoice that mentions the steering shaft. So it must be that right. I can’t think of anything else it could be.

I know it’s a newbie question, but I got to ask. In regards to the Cherokee shaft replacement. The original shafts are the same on 3/4 and half tons right?

Climb up there and have a helper rock the wheel back and forth, you'll see play at the ragjoint if that's it. The columns on these trucks get all loosey goosey also, could be that as well. You'll just have to track it down.

 

[shiftpro]

New U bolts?
Re-torqued?
If the driver side was a c hair loose it would translate to steering play.
Your springs were changed so I'm sure the U bolts were too... but then again, no rust and low miles that knucklehead mechanic (who says "it's just the way these 3/4 ton 4wds are, that they had a lot of slop even when they were new") might have reused them.
Regardless,
new U bolts need to be re-torqued even a few times.

 

[Jon Karnes]

You must be registered for see images attach

I’ll check that the uboltsxare still tight. They are definitely new though

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[shiftpro]

If you really want your truck to handle mod to cross of steering. It will steer like a BMW (on 33" tires all things fair).
And what the hell, long travel shocks and sway bar disconnect and you would have a very trail worthy rig, if that's what you want.
You got the tires...
Also need a rear locker at the least.

 

[Jon Karnes]

Ok, I’ve heard of crossover steering. Don’t know anything about it though. There is a company in Colorado that makes a cross over conversions specifically for the 3/4 and 1 ton squarebodies with cummins conversions. I’ll definitely check in to that further. Also looking at their fourlink coil over conversion. But daaaaaaang, it’s pricey.

 

[shiftpro]

I hope your brake line is longer than it appears in the pic.

 

[Jon Karnes]

Im a newbie so be gentle. You can see a little of the new steering box in this picture. Does this look like a 31 year old rag joint to you guys?

You must be registered for see images attach