Trailer wiring

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Turbo4whl

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Not a fancy one with a display, just the led indicator that's supposed to light up green when connected, then turn to various shades of orange and red as the brakes are applied.
This is the cheapest model that Tekonsha sells. Our newest International's all have a better model made by the same company. They are a Prodigy P2:

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This one, at twice the price as the Voyager model has the feature you seek.

The trailer wiring upfit for the IH also has what is needed for air brake trailers too. New air brake trailers are required to have anti-lock brakes. Most all have separate turn and brake lights as well.

Like you stated there is no standard colors for the added on harness. I think your Intentional dealer could have done much better for you. I would like to see how well they hooked up the other end of the harness. Probably looks like the junction box I pictured.

The fact that our IH trucks also have aftermarket controllers, I guess you cannot get a in-dash controller like all our Fords have. I will follow up with the vehicle procurement group to find out.
 

Turbo4whl

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5v is almost always sensor or diagnostic related. I wonder if it’s for abs or stability. I’ve seen some trailers with ABS related features, but no idea how they work.
I'll talk more about this later. Bed time now.
 

bucket

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This is the cheapest model that Tekonsha sells. Our newest International's all have a better model made by the same company. They are a Prodigy P2:

You must be registered for see images attach


This one, at twice the price as the Voyager model has the feature you seek.

The trailer wiring upfit for the IH also has what is needed for air brake trailers too. New air brake trailers are required to have anti-lock brakes. Most all have separate turn and brake lights as well.

Like you stated there is no standard colors for the added on harness. I think your Intentional dealer could have done much better for you. I would like to see how well they hooked up the other end of the harness. Probably looks like the junction box I pictured.

The fact that our IH trucks also have aftermarket controllers, I guess you cannot get a in-dash controller like all our Fords have. I will follow up with the vehicle procurement group to find out.

Yeah, I've run that Prodigy controller on other trucks and it's pretty nice.

The folks at Morgan that installed the boxes did not do the best wiring job. But that was just a few wires. The trucks came with frame mounted taillights and they have their own harness from International. I have since ditched those lights and installed taillights with strobes in the rear of the box and did all the wiring connections to my liking. We are probably going to install in-dash controllers (Red Arc) like we wanted to begin with, but time is limited. We are still building out the inside of the boxes and I still have to run all the associated electrical for lights and pumps. I did finally finish the install of the bumpers and hitches.

Our trucks are air brake (all disc) if that has something to do with the 5v wire.
 

Frankenchevy

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We are probably going to install in-dash controllers (Red Arc) like we wanted to begin with, but time is limited.
Depending on the truck’s electrical system, you may need to install a diode to prevent lamp flickering with the tow pro from redarc. I discovered this one night when I looked outside and saw my truck lights flickering.

Tow pro makes a kit now, but it’s a bit pricey for something you can replicate for much cheaper.
 

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When I posted the wiring diagram for the heavy duty trailers, it was the blue ABS control wire I was referring to. I'd wager that the 5v is for the ABS controller.
 

bucket

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When I posted the wiring diagram for the heavy duty trailers, it was the blue ABS control wire I was referring to. I'd wager that the 5v is for the ABS controller.

That blue wire in the diagram is also the AUX power wire. I won't swear to it, but I recall that terminal being 12v on our semis and our farm tractors.
 

bucket

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I got back to the shop today and quickly peaked under the dash to hopefully see how they wired the controller. Unfortunately, the wires go way up into the dash. I did not have the time (and my back was not feeling it) to investigate further. But I did get a picture of the weatherpack connectors that are supposed to be the optional "trailer harness".

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^^^Despite many of those wires having the same function as the body harness, the colors are different. Also, the random green wire was installed by the box installer. It is for the interior box light.

And here's what I've done to the back of the trucks. The taillight harness has been repurposed to run the taillights I installed in the box. The body harness is used for the trailer plug. The trailer harness is just unused.

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Turbo4whl

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To help understand truck air brakes a brief run through history. In the 1960’s some trucks had the earliest form of safe braking with the slippery road or wet road valve. This dash control valve cut the air pressure in half for the front brakes. Also maxi chambers appeared. These rear chambers have a spring applied parking brake. Before this, other parking brakes like drive shaft drum etc.

Starting in the 1970’s was the 121 braking system. This system, originally designed for truck tractors to have a complete separate brake system for the trailer. The system, two tanks and a brake treadle valve having two separate valves. This way if the air lines between truck and trailer failed, the tractor still had brakes. The duel system was quickly added to all air brake trucks and the tractor protection valve was added for the trailer supply valve.

In the 1980’s the air systems were revised and experimented with more complicated valves. One example was if the rear air system failed, air from the front system was applied to the rear maxi chambers. Some of this air would be released to apply the rear brakes. Short lived, thankfully.

In the 1990’s, anti-lock brake systems for truck air brakes were added. Required by 1998? This electronic system with wheel speed sensors and electric solenoids dumps the air from the axle that shows a locked wheel. This system when installed on a trailer is powered up by the trailer brake light wire.

We get out of the Way-back machine and now to that 5 volt wire. @Frankenchevy has the answer. It’s a sensor wire. Since the brake light turns on the anti-lock system, how do we know the system will work? Some of these changes were requested (required) by big brother.

How the 5V check system works. When you turn on the key, the BCM (body control module) or the ECM (engine control module) {where ever they hid it} measures the resistances load on the wire just like most other sensors. If everything checks out, the module blinks the ABS amber light at the rear of the trailer. If there is a problem the ABS amber light stays on and a trailer ABS warning light comes on the dash.

@bucket I checked at work, on the trailer brake factory option, all you get are all the wires pre-installed. As you found out that option provides plenty of wires ready to hook up however needed. Your dealer "cheaped out" with the controller they added.
 

bucket

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To help understand truck air brakes a brief run through history. In the 1960’s some trucks had the earliest form of safe braking with the slippery road or wet road valve. This dash control valve cut the air pressure in half for the front brakes. Also maxi chambers appeared. These rear chambers have a spring applied parking brake. Before this, other parking brakes like drive shaft drum etc.

Starting in the 1970’s was the 121 braking system. This system, originally designed for truck tractors to have a complete separate brake system for the trailer. The system, two tanks and a brake treadle valve having two separate valves. This way if the air lines between truck and trailer failed, the tractor still had brakes. The duel system was quickly added to all air brake trucks and the tractor protection valve was added for the trailer supply valve.

In the 1980’s the air systems were revised and experimented with more complicated valves. One example was if the rear air system failed, air from the front system was applied to the rear maxi chambers. Some of this air would be released to apply the rear brakes. Short lived, thankfully.

In the 1990’s, anti-lock brake systems for truck air brakes were added. Required by 1998? This electronic system with wheel speed sensors and electric solenoids dumps the air from the axle that shows a locked wheel. This system when installed on a trailer is powered up by the trailer brake light wire.

We get out of the Way-back machine and now to that 5 volt wire. @Frankenchevy has the answer. It’s a sensor wire. Since the brake light turns on the anti-lock system, how do we know the system will work? Some of these changes were requested (required) by big brother.

How the 5V check system works. When you turn on the key, the BCM (body control module) or the ECM (engine control module) {where ever they hid it} measures the resistances load on the wire just like most other sensors. If everything checks out, the module blinks the ABS amber light at the rear of the trailer. If there is a problem the ABS amber light stays on and a trailer ABS warning light comes on the dash.

@bucket I checked at work, on the trailer brake factory option, all you get are all the wires pre-installed. As you found out that option provides plenty of wires ready to hook up however needed. Your dealer "cheaped out" with the controller they added.

Do you have any idea why that 5v wire would have constant power and not ignition power? Do they now offer electric brake trailers with ABS? I ask because there's no air hookups at the rear of the truck, just that 5v wire.

I'm also still puzzled how the brake controller can operate the trailer brakes, but the light doesn't light up. It is the same on all 4 trucks. I'm very familiar with that model of controller too, we've run them for years on other trucks.
 

Turbo4whl

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but the light doesn't light up
The things I can think of, the controller is missing it's own ground connection or maybe it is wired up backwards?
 

bigcountry78

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@bucket are all 4 trucks having the same issue? If so, I would think that would rule out defective parts. It almost has to be something that the installer wired incorrectly. I have used that same model controller in my last couple of trucks, and have one in my Titan now. Could it be a problem on the trailer side? Is this happening with one brand/type of trailer, or across several different types? I have had issues where everything would work right on one trailer, but not on another one. Apparently, there is no standard on trailer wiring. It’s whatever Bob feels like doing today.
 

bucket

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@bucket are all 4 trucks having the same issue? If so, I would think that would rule out defective parts. It almost has to be something that the installer wired incorrectly. I have used that same model controller in my last couple of trucks, and have one in my Titan now. Could it be a problem on the trailer side? Is this happening with one brand/type of trailer, or across several different types? I have had issues where everything would work right on one trailer, but not on another one. Apparently, there is no standard on trailer wiring. It’s whatever Bob feels like doing today.

Yes, all 4 trucks. The controllers were all installed by the dealer (still frustrated about that) and it doesn't matter what trailer we plug into. All of our trailers are wired the same (done buy ourselves because it seems trailer manufacturers always do shoddy wiring) using the common "7-way traditional" pinout.
 

bucket

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The things I can think of, the controller is missing it's own ground connection or maybe it is wired up backwards?

Wired backwards seems plausible. I think you are on to something.
 

Turbo4whl

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Apparently, there is no standard on trailer wiring. It’s whatever Bob feels like doing today.
Yes, and his coworker does it their way, so multiple vehicle or trailer orders might not be the same either.
 

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