more wiper and washer motor fun

[gmbellew]

I saw your other posts on the cardone wiper motors. I ordered a WAI motor just now. I will try that before the switch, because it is a lot easier to replace than the switch. otherwise I have 2 bad pulse modules or a bad switch, as best I can tell.

 

[AuroraGirl]

Your column still has a switch mounted to it , the switches from 83 to 90 would be different. Because 2 speed wipers AND delay were avaialable 83-87, 88+ but its a crap shoot and a half

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Base left, right pulse
'

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yours should be the bottom one

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and, if you have a 2 to 3 wire situation
see next post

 

[AuroraGirl]

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gm sells this 22087381

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[SirRobyn0]

Your column still has a switch mounted to it , the switches from 83 to 90 would be different. Because 2 speed wipers AND delay were avaialable 83-87, 88+ but its a crap shoot and a half

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Base left, right pulse
'

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yours should be the bottom one

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and, if you have a 2 to 3 wire situation
see next post

Keeping mind he has delay, and your schematic is for non-delay, however I will point out that it shows the ground tab path on the motor. Also shows that the washer motor is driven from a signal off the wiper motor which is how I thought the worked. Another little abnormality for you @AuroraGirl My truck is an 84 but has the previous style mechanical pump for the washers built into the motor. It's almost as if they had to use up last years stock before installing the new system.

 

[gmbellew]

those schematics are a little different than what is shown in the GM manual. I am not sure exactly why or where those diagrams are from. but my plan is to swap the wiper motor for the better brand (that seems to come with a case ground) and see what that does. if that doesn't correct the issue, it is likely either the switch or potentially an issue with the common ground above the E brake.

 

[SirRobyn0]

@gmbellew I'm sorry I had a heck of a day at work today and did not respond to you properly. Even if lets just suppose that the wiper motor is not at fault, getting into the WIA motor will save you head aches down the road, they are a much, much better product and I'm glad to see you do that.

As for the diagrams there are two major differences I can see. The diagram Taylor posted is a simplified non-delay system, yours if a full with delay diagram. A simplified diagram does not show connector or pins where a full diagram will, but I'm hardly an expert where it comes to reading diagrams, I just so happen to know these systems pretty good.

 

[AuroraGirl]

Keeping mind he has delay, and your schematic is for non-delay, however I will point out that it shows the ground tab path on the motor. Also shows that the washer motor is driven from a signal off the wiper motor which is how I thought the worked. Another little abnormality for you @AuroraGirl My truck is an 84 but has the previous style mechanical pump for the washers built into the motor. It's almost as if they had to use up last years stock before installing the new system.

they made versions of the pump too where the washer reservoir pump was on the wiper motor and it was connected to the reservoir and pulled it

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[SirRobyn0]

@AuroraGirl see that's what I'm more use to seeing is where the external pump is still driven though the motor, as it was just an external add on, but he says his system isn't like that and his diagram supports that somewhat. The thing is we do not know how the internals of the delay module work and it could be that it doubles as a washer relay, but I can't tell from the small image, and even if it was larger we still wouldn't know the internal circuitry.

Regardless once he gets the new motor in at least we will have eliminated that issue.

 

[gmbellew]

I finally got a chance to get back to this issue. I replaced the wiper motor with a WAI motor today. that has everything working again, for now. prior to swapping the motor, the delay almost never worked and the washer would work sporadically. it makes me wonder if the washer motor also relies on the ground that runs through the motor circuitry because the washer also makes the wipers sweep, and the two grounds are tied together at the pulse module or something.

I will update again if the washer stops working. otherwise, it is all good.

 

[SirRobyn0]

@gmbellew Glad to here it. Yea, that's the thing (and I run into this issue at the shop) we can look at, decipher and break down wiring diagrams until the cows come home, but what goes on inside that module.... How exactly does the circuitry work in there? Sometimes it's pretty hard to tell.

 

[Doppleganger]

General question about these wiper motors: are they of the permanent magnet design? When I was restoring 4-N cars, I rebuilt my own wiper motors because, as you said, remans are garbage. Most every time the issue was the magnets (3/8 - 1/2" thick curved) that were glued inside the housing, would come off and totally sandbag the armature. They would use a really lame glue that was never going to hold that strong of a magnet and it would let loose within 6 months if it wasn't already loose when 'new'. I'd use 3M panel adhesive or POR patch and never have an issue again.

Just curious as I am semi-unimpressed with the factory setup and know I'll be addressing it in some midevil fashion.

 

[75gmck25]

These GM wiper motors seem to be something that was designed by the lowest bidder in the early sixties and then never really improved much. Mine struggles to keep the blades moving if there is any ice or snow, and looks like it could quit at any time. And nobody makes something as simple as a heavy duty wiper motor.

 

[SirRobyn0]

These GM wiper motors seem to be something that was designed by the lowest bidder in the early sixties and then never really improved much. Mine struggles to keep the blades moving if there is any ice or snow, and looks like it could quit at any time. And nobody makes something as simple as a heavy duty wiper motor.

Actually Detroit speed makes an upgrade kit motor and harness is almost $600!!!! Not something I'm interested in at that price that's for sure.

 

[SirRobyn0]

@Doppleganger Yes they are permanent magnet type.

 

[Doppleganger]

These GM wiper motors seem to be something that was designed by the lowest bidder in the early sixties and then never really improved much. Mine struggles to keep the blades moving if there is any ice or snow, and looks like it could quit at any time. And nobody makes something as simple as a heavy duty wiper motor.

This sounds sooooo much like magnets that came loose and are sand bagging the armature. I'm itching to pull one of these motors apart.